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Topic : 07/17 The Dr. Phil House: Man Camp, Part 2

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Created on : Friday, February 02, 2007, 03:00:27 pm
Author : DrPhilBoard1
(Original Air Date: 02/06/07) An intensive workshop continues in The Dr. Phil House as three wives turn their husbands in to Man Camp in a last-ditch effort to save their marriages. After Scott refuses to clean up a mess in the house, he has an angry discussion with Dr. Phil and storms out. Can his wife, Tara, convince him to give the experience another shot for the sake of his marriage and his family? Then, John and Nic roll up their sleeves and begin to clean the house, while their wives secretly watch in amazement. Will they have a new appreciation for what their better halves do on a daily basis? Plus, Dr. Phil sits down with Nic and Amanda. What did they do to nearly get kicked out of The Dr. Phil House? And will Amanda agree to bring in the man she’s been having an affair with, so she can tell him in front of Dr. Phil that it’s over, once and for all? Join the discussion.

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February 10, 2007, 9:28 am CST

so what you're saying

Quote From: leah1991

There was a woman in our local area years ago who was severely abused by her husabnd or boyfriend. We're not talking about just a little slap or a shove. This guy beat her like a man. She did end having him put in prison. Unfortunately after he had been in there a while he got on some kind of work release program where he could actually leave the prison briefly to do his job. When he did that he went and murdered the woman he had beat and who put him in prison. Several years later I had the opportunity to actually work with the murderers cousin. I don't know how much truth there is to it but she said that the woman was a real witch, she would antagonize him and if I recall she had cheated on him. She was just as abusive as she was. I suppose she thought she was just standing up to him.

 

I don't believe in just putting up with stuff but if you decide to stand up to them you better consider carefully how you do it. You just may get yourself killed.

is that this 'witch' who cheated and antagonized this guy deserved to die?

 

How about blaming the victim?  She sure asked for it, didn't she?  I mean, wow, this man had no choice except to kill her, right? 

 

Get real.  How many men go into shelters?  How many men go to court for restraining orders?  How many men are stalked and harrassed and beaten by their wives/girlfriends?  That 'they abused each other' is nothing more than bs. 

 

Who wound up dead?

 

please...

 

 

 

 
February 10, 2007, 10:43 am CST

02/06 The Dr. Phil House: Man Camp, Part 2

Quote From: joysonshine

God Bless You I just read your message today haven't been on it since the last time I wrote you & again you blessed me!

I know Groovy meant well though & had truth to what he said....

And what you said did too, it's like between both of you it bought balance to myself.

My husband wants a divorce, he thinks I am at fault for everything that happened in the relationship, that we are separated cause of me & he chooses not to see his own faults & his emotional abuse. I let it go & put it in God's hands he will take care of this situation....

I rest in HIM.

Blessings....and say hi if you are here again, me too this is my first message board ever....

I can't wait to see what happens next week.

:O)

Hello again! It's good to hear from you.

 

I think a lot of the women and men on here mean well, I just don't agree with all of their thoughts on things and they don't agree all with me. I can live with that.

 

It is easy to quote psychological books but I think that they often tend to generalize and stereotype people. I used to read a lot of different books on marriage and I did some reading on abuse but I didn't find them to be too helpful. They often just label and identify problem behavior but they offer little help in doing anything about it. They often say something to the effect, "If you are in this kind of relationship get help immediately." The problem is that even the help that is available is limited. Even if your abusive spouse comes over and beats your brains out after you leave him, they won't put him in jail and throw away the key. He'll get out eventually and most likely hate you more than before he went in. If you don't have children together you can move, change your name and hope he doesn't come looking for you. If you do have children together he still has parental rights. Try that and the law will come looking for you. They'll put you in jail and give him the kids for interference of visitation. If you can't prove that your child is being physically abused this is the boat a woman finds herself in. Then she has to send her children with their father every other weekend and she won't be there to intervene if that should be necessary. She hasn't escaped her abuser. She just doesn't live in the same house with him anymore. This is a cold hard truth I found out the hard way. That's why I see things a little different I guess. I see this happen time and time again with other couples as well. A lot of this may depend on the state your in. Some states are tougher on abuse.

 

That's why I highly recommend doing what the Bible says to make peace. There will be those people for whom nothing will pacify their hatred. But I would definately the take the chance on trying.

 

I thought of another good book that I thought was very good that you might be interested in. It is by James Dobson called Love Must Be Tough. He has a lot of wisdom and does an excellent job of expaining how relationships often go bad and become abusive in the first place. He also offers a lot of wisdom on how to break that cycle. The priniples in that book can be applied to any relationship though he is primarily talking about marriage. I think It would be a great read for parents dealing with out of control teenagers or other estranged relationships as well.

 

I hope these books are helpful to you. The Proverbs have a lot of wisdom on how to get along with people and handle all kinds of situations.

 

I need to run. I'll look for ya.

 

 

 
February 10, 2007, 1:13 pm CST

Man Camp

Scott's anger works for him.  When he starts screaming and yelling evryone gets out of his way or tries to cajole him he screams some more and what was expected of him is forgotten.  He pulled the same crap with the guys that he pulls with his wife.  Guess What?  He got away with not cleaning.  he got what he wanted.  he is lazy and uses his ugly ways to his advangage.  Why anyone would want to save that so-called marriage is beyod me. 

 
February 10, 2007, 4:29 pm CST

Funny I was talking about that book

Quote From: leah1991

Hello again! It's good to hear from you.

 

I think a lot of the women and men on here mean well, I just don't agree with all of their thoughts on things and they don't agree all with me. I can live with that.

 

It is easy to quote psychological books but I think that they often tend to generalize and stereotype people. I used to read a lot of different books on marriage and I did some reading on abuse but I didn't find them to be too helpful. They often just label and identify problem behavior but they offer little help in doing anything about it. They often say something to the effect, "If you are in this kind of relationship get help immediately." The problem is that even the help that is available is limited. Even if your abusive spouse comes over and beats your brains out after you leave him, they won't put him in jail and throw away the key. He'll get out eventually and most likely hate you more than before he went in. If you don't have children together you can move, change your name and hope he doesn't come looking for you. If you do have children together he still has parental rights. Try that and the law will come looking for you. They'll put you in jail and give him the kids for interference of visitation. If you can't prove that your child is being physically abused this is the boat a woman finds herself in. Then she has to send her children with their father every other weekend and she won't be there to intervene if that should be necessary. She hasn't escaped her abuser. She just doesn't live in the same house with him anymore. This is a cold hard truth I found out the hard way. That's why I see things a little different I guess. I see this happen time and time again with other couples as well. A lot of this may depend on the state your in. Some states are tougher on abuse.

 

That's why I highly recommend doing what the Bible says to make peace. There will be those people for whom nothing will pacify their hatred. But I would definately the take the chance on trying.

 

I thought of another good book that I thought was very good that you might be interested in. It is by James Dobson called Love Must Be Tough. He has a lot of wisdom and does an excellent job of expaining how relationships often go bad and become abusive in the first place. He also offers a lot of wisdom on how to break that cycle. The priniples in that book can be applied to any relationship though he is primarily talking about marriage. I think It would be a great read for parents dealing with out of control teenagers or other estranged relationships as well.

 

I hope these books are helpful to you. The Proverbs have a lot of wisdom on how to get along with people and handle all kinds of situations.

 

I need to run. I'll look for ya.

 

 

yesterday love must be tough....I have heard some things that are in the book, but have not read it....seems like we are being led by The Lord I would say....

I wanted to let you know that I did try peace with my husband but it didn't work he still continued to abuse. I know one thing for sure I tried & I tried real hard even walking with the scriptures in mind & still my husband continued being manipulative & controlling....how sad, God gave him everything he ever needed or wanted but it still wasn't enough for him. :O(

I am trusting in God that he is in control of the situation & my husband & he knows all things & knows I am trusting him to lead the way.

God Bless & looking forward to next time.

:O)

 
February 10, 2007, 6:47 pm CST

its good to see that your values are in the right

Quote From: pjrskiatook

wow, i don't understand why these people don't just divorce even if there are kids involved. it would be better to be happy in a single parent home than scared to death in a home with these couples, i am glad that my folks did not raise me in a environment like that.....i am glad that my marriage was good...unfortunately not long enough...........I guess the Lord needed another angel.....i am a widow now...........do these people think about how short life really is.....one day everything is great and the next day he doesn't come in for dinner and you better make sure that you said i love you before you leave each day....

order. It is so important to enjoy our spouses & look at each day as a gift from God.

And if you can't enjoy your spouse because he/she won't allow that to happen no matter how you try & keep the peace, then you must make a decision. Emotional abuse is definitely a deal breaker!

 
February 10, 2007, 6:58 pm CST

Blame?

Quote From: lyninsocal

is that this 'witch' who cheated and antagonized this guy deserved to die?

 

How about blaming the victim?  She sure asked for it, didn't she?  I mean, wow, this man had no choice except to kill her, right? 

 

Get real.  How many men go into shelters?  How many men go to court for restraining orders?  How many men are stalked and harrassed and beaten by their wives/girlfriends?  That 'they abused each other' is nothing more than bs. 

 

Who wound up dead?

 

please...

 

 

 

Who said anything about blame or what she deserved. I only suggested that the girl I replied to needed to be a litle smarter than her attitude on this board indicated. Ever heard the saying, "Fools rush in where angels fear to tread"?
 
February 11, 2007, 11:36 am CST

02/06 The Dr. Phil House: Man Camp, Part 2

Quote From: leah1991

I will be praying for you. I have never gotten on message boards in my life other than posting a few questions on ancestry.com when I was working on a family tree. This isn't my thing. But this issue is so near my heart because I've been there. What men and women go through in a marriage when they lack the tools for having a healthy relationship grieves my heart.

 

I know that to a lot of women my advice sounds down right insane. Ten years ago I would've been the first to say that. It used to anger me when people would talk about forgiveness and the need to love my enemy. I would just think, "You have no clue. If you had an ex like mine you would never say something stupid like that." I couldn't see how bitter I had become and I certainly didn't take any responsibility for the situation. I was the classic victim and he was the monster. Coincidently all that underlying anger I had pent up inside often turned into borderline abuse for my own kids. No, I didn't beat them or anything. But I did yell at them a lot and belittled them at times when I disciplined them. The fact is all angry people are abusive in one form or another, unless they have learned the skills for processing their anger appropriatelyand have learned to forgive. We need to get the logs out of our own eyes before we can see clearly to get the specks out of our husbands eyes.

 

It bothers me when women just throw out the term ABUSER, like they have totally disassociated this man from being a person. I prefer to not use labels and just see an angry man who lacks the skills he needs to handle his anger in an appropriate fashion. It doesn't lessen the hurt they cause but it does help me to remember that he is a human being with feelings too and he can change if he wants to. They are much more inspired to want to change when they aren't treated with judgement and condemnation. That is true of all people. Judgement only begets more judgement.

 

My purpose of being on here was to share what I have learned and how God has brought awesome change in my relationships. That was too good to keep to myself. If it helps even one person then I am glad.

 

I don't know if you're still posting on here. I'll probablly watch the post for a few more days then get back to life. I may post again in the future when the subject comes up again. If you're on I'll say hi.

 

I hope that book is as helpful to you as it was to me. Love and Respect by Emmerson Eggerichs is another real good one. In fact you can get a CD of him on Focus on the Family's website. It's only like 9 bucks or something. He's hilarious as well as an excellent teacher. That was very inciteful for me as well. The web address is www.family.org. You would need to click on the Tapes, CD, etc. tab. Then type Emerson Eggerichs in the search engine. You can probably get his books cheaper elsewhere, but get the CD for sure. It is the same as the book Love and Respect. The book will cover a few more things than he covers on the CD but he's so funny to listen to I highly recommned the CD.

 

May God grant you a fulfilling marriage as you seek to obey him.

 

Candace

I believe in calling a spade a spade...and an abusive man is an ABUSER. Sure, he's got feelings. He's got feelings when he's smacking his partner around. He's got feelings when he's making his children's lives a living hell.

I'm not judging an abuser...I care about the woman he's abusing. And as far as an abusive man changing? Show me the statistics of where they've *really* changed. For good. Unfortunately, it is rare. Very rare, indeed. You can call an abuser something else...but he's still going to be an abuser. "A rose by any other name...."

 
February 11, 2007, 12:25 pm CST

02/06 The Dr. Phil House: Man Camp, Part 2

Quote From: pearlette

Then you need to get help or get out.  You need to get you and your children if any to Al Anon or

Ala-Teen.  You are worthy of much more.  If I can do it, so can you.  He will not change unless he wants to.  Why do people think they have to stay?  Yes, the world it big, bad, and scary out there all by yourself.  But I tell you, waking up knowing you don't have to put up with someone's physical, emotional, or verbal abuse are a big relief.  And it's a one day at a time thing.  I don't know if you work or what keeps you busy but you need to find something.  Counseling??  If not, go yourself.  If they see you changing....you never know.  One can easily become as toxic as the person you're describing.  I know, I've been there.  I hope this show is giving everyone something to think about.  And there are fee based mental health counselors out there.  Dig out the phone book.  My best to you. 

Yes, I know that I need to get out. We do have a child that witnesses this mess and my child and I deserve better than this. He says he will change and I give him the opportunity and then a month or less later he is right back to the same old thing. Then we go through it all over again. He begs and pleads, makes empty promises and cries his heart out. He says this time he will change because I have told him that I am done with this. He then does the things that are his responsibility and that gives me hope. I do love him but I just can't imagine him ever being any different unless something drastic happens. Thanks for your suggestions. One day at a time.
 
February 11, 2007, 10:04 pm CST

02/06 The Dr. Phil House: Man Camp, Part 2

Quote From: groovy

Lundy Bancroft in "Why Does He Do That" points out that most abusive men DO have anger management skills.  They simply CHOOSE not to use them with their wives and girlfriends.  But they handle anger quite appropriately when dealing with their bosses, the police officer writing them a ticket, and in other situations where they RESPECT the other person.

 

I understand that you don't like labels.  However, these abused women need to dissociate from the person who is abusing them and treating them sub-humanly.  Many abused women are not fully conscious they are being abused nor what the abuse is doing to them and their children.  Using the term "abuser" helps them put their situation into perspective.

 

Abusers only change when they want to.  But most of them don't want to, as they're gaining too much from their power trip.  Under no circumstances should the woman lower herself to his level.  But hanging in there day in and day out treating him with "respect" while he disrespects his wife is to submit to abuser.  Abusive men rarely change their ways without at least a year of counseling specific to abusive men.  This business that the wife needs to unilaterally change and he will follow does not work for the vast majority of women.  It makes the woman into a doormat and prolongs the abuse.

 

I fought with myself for years about how to handle my (ex-)husband's anger.  The first time he hit me, I listened when he told me he couldn't control himself. I thought about how his father is ten times worse than he is, and I thought about how it must have been for him to grow up like that.

 

I didn't feel like I was being a victim. I really wanted to understand him and help him. And I knew it was wrong, the way he treated me. But still, it was still a fight to maintain any self-esteem after hearing him degrade me for years.

 

But he said he loved me. He was nice at times. He said he was sorry. I mean, you are supposed to love your wife, right? He must really have had such horrible issues that he absolutely could not control himself, I thought. He told me it was like a light switch. Once it was turned on, there was nothing he could do to stop himself.

 

Until I called the cops on him. He realized that his career could be affected adversely if he harmed me physically. He never laid another hand on me again.

 

Of course, the mental and emotional abuse continued, and I eventually left. But knowing that he could have stopped hitting me before, but just chose not to, hurts more than the fact that he ever hit me in the first place.

 

He is remarried now, they have a house, he has a great career, and they seem pretty happy. His new wife has better relationship skills and self-esteem than I have ever had, and I guess they have worked on their marriage to where they are in a pretty good place.

 

Even now, six years after we split up, hearing Dr. Phil say that no matter how crappy a wife or mother you are, you don't deserve to be called names really hits home with me. I made my fair share of mistakes in my marriage, but knowing that Dr. Phil would tell me that it wasn't my fault that he hit me really means something.

 

Um, right. Anyway, to anyone who thinks like I did, that they can't help it, you are wrong. They can help it. They can control themselves. They just don't want to. They have no motivation. They act like jerks and you are still there. Why change?

 

 

 
February 12, 2007, 8:57 am CST

BEST QUOTE YET!! UR SO RIGHT

Quote From: vincenza12

Scott's anger works for him.  When he starts screaming and yelling evryone gets out of his way or tries to cajole him he screams some more and what was expected of him is forgotten.  He pulled the same crap with the guys that he pulls with his wife.  Guess What?  He got away with not cleaning.  he got what he wanted.  he is lazy and uses his ugly ways to his advangage.  Why anyone would want to save that so-called marriage is beyod me. 

need i say more, ur 100% correct.
 
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